This article first appeared in the St. Louis Beacon, July 30, 2012 - St. Louis’ two Democratic members of Congress, William Lacy Clay Jr. and Russ Carnahan, once again tangled over congressional redistricting – and who was to blame for their predicament -- during their first and only public debate.
The two squared off for an hour this morning in the studio of radio station KMOX (1120 AM), with Charlie Brennan as the host. They also sparred over the rent-to-own industry, the bank bailout, the estate tax and how long to keep troops in Afghanistan.
The two are vying in the Aug. 7 primary over who gets to stay in Congress. They were tossed into the same congressional district when the Republican-controlled General Assembly drew up a new state map in 2011 reflecting population shifts in the 2010 census, which also led to Missouri losing a congressional district.
Legislators then overrode the veto of Gov. Jay Nixon, a Democrat.
In the debate’s first exchange, Carnahan repeated his assertions that Clay was to blame for the map and alleged he had pressured fellow Democrats in his district to override Nixon’s veto.
“St. Louis really lost,” Carnahan said. “It’s really bigger than all of us. We lost clout for our region. We lost clout for our party. We lost a vote for Democrats in Congress. And support for President (Barack) Obama.”
Clay denied any such action, saying he had called a legislator – at Carnahan’s behest – to talk them out of voting to override the governor. Clay also cited a letter that he cosigned with Carnahan and U.S. Rep. Emanuel Cleaver, D-Kansas City, that called on the General Assembly to approve a map that retained three congressional districts in the St. Louis area.
“On the morning of the veto override, Congressman Carnahan called me and asked me to call a state legislator to get to them to sustain to the governor’s veto,” said Clay, who on Friday noted that the lawmaker was state Rep. Rochelle Walton Gray, D-Black Jack. “So this is untrue. I helped throughout this process. It’s just another example of the kind of deception that has gone on throughout this campaign.”
Carnahan countered by noting that Clay's lawyer filed a brief with the state Supreme Court defending the map that threw them together. Although he didn't mention it during the debate, Clay said on Friday that his lawyer "reminded the court of the importance of the Voting Rights Act" and several amendments to the U.S. Constitution.
(Also not mentioned: Two Democratic state lawmakers from Kansas City -- state Reps. Jonas Hughes and Michael Brown -- publicly stated they voted to override Nixon's veto to protect Cleaver.)
With their battle now underway, Clay contended that he was the stronger progressive and accused Carnahan of being too moderate. Both claimed to be the stronger defender of Medicare, Social Security and reproductive rights. Both cited their support for ending tax breaks on millionaires.
Clay blasted Carnahan for backing the bank bailouts in late 2008 and early 2009, which had been sought by the Bush and Obama administrations to prevent an economic collapse.
Clay said that, in retrospect, "it wasn't all that great of an accomplishment."
Carnahan noted that bipartisan leaders had pressed for passage, warning of dire consequences if the bailout weren't passed. "It was a tough vote. It was a responsible vote," Carnahan said.
Among the candidates' other disagreements:
The estate tax: Carnahan said he supported retaining an estate tax, imposed after death, on property and holdings above a certain level. The tax is now assessed on estates greater than $5 million. Carnahan said he backed keeping it on that level or lowering it to $3.5 million.
“I have opposed complete elimination of the estate tax, particularly in these tough economic times,” Carnahan said.
Clay, who discussed his position on the issue late last week, said he philosophically is opposed to an estate tax, believing it taxes double the money and property that people have earned in their lifetime.
War in Afghanistan: Clay called for the immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan, saying "we have lost too much treasure" in American lives. He noted that terrorist Osama bin Laden was killed by the U.S. in Pakistan.
“In my opinion, I think our assignment in Afghanistan is over,” Clay said.
Carnahan said he supported the Obama administration's schedule of a phased-in withdrawal, ending in 2014.
“The mission there has been way too costly,” Carnahan said. “There’s been way too much corruption and waste. We’ve had hearings in the foreign affairs committee where I sit about that waste, fraud and abuse, how that can be tightened up. And ultimately, we have to bring our military troops home and bring some of that money home."
The Tea Party connection: As he did at a Friday press conference, Clay accused Carnahan of "standing with the Tea Party" because he didn't vote for the budget amendment by the House Progressive Caucus.
In response, Carnahan challenged Brennan and Clay to find "one Tea Party person in America that says I sided with them."
"That's really laughable," said Carnahan, who added that he voted against the Republican budget and voted in favor of Democratic alternatives.
Carnahan then questioned Clay why he didn't show up to vote for a budget alternative by the Congressional Black Caucus. Clay countered that he had voted for such amendments in the past, while adding Carnahan only started voting for them in the last two years.
Rent-to-own industry: Carnahan repeated his contention that the high interest rates imposed by the industry on rent-to-own customers is just as bad as the payday loan industry. Clay said that many poor people needed the rent-to-own industry and that most firms are responsible and should not be equated with the payday loan industry, which he also opposes.
Clay asked Carnahan why he had cosponsored legislation to provide disclosures of the terms of rental-purchase agreements.
"It was only 60 days ago that he removed his name from the bill because he was going to use it in attack ads against me," Clay said.
After noting that he was formerly a consponsor of the bill to which Clay referred, Carnahan said, "We've seen things get worse in this industry, we've seen consumer groups call it out as not good and we've seen our Department of Defense label these industries as predators."
"This is not good enough," Carnahan said. "The bill has too many loopholes for disclosures. And it doesn't let states set higher standards."
Minimum wage: Both also made the same gaffe during discussion of the federal minimum wage. Both said it was $7.45. Host Brennan noted that it was really $7.25. Both congressmen agreed that they wanted to see the minimum wage increased.
The two also agreed, during the end of the debate, to back the victor in November and to help other Democrats on their party's ticket.
"My challenge to Congressman Clay is let's see who's the true Democrat here today," Carnahan said. "And let's agree that after this election is done, we're going to sit down, we're going to endorse the winner and we're going to get to work on the race in November of re-electing the president" and U.S. Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo.
"For 30 years I've been a loyal Democrat and will remain that," Clay said later, adding that he would agree to come together after the primary.
Carnahan had sought additional debates or forums and appeared without Clay at a forum on Saturday held by the St. Louis League of Women Voters. Clay also declined a debate, now cancelled, to be televised on KETC-TV (Channel 9). The cohosts were to include the Beacon and St. Louis Public Radio.
